The current 12 best players on the site
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slackbatter wrote:
We have a new Dominator:

Congratulations to Irob!

Dominator badge, double points, and 1 month free premium awarded.
dough_boy wrote:
Slack I think something is broken on the D12 calculations. You are supposed to have 5 "played" (completed) games in the last 15 days.

Just looking at the D12 list stats over the last few months, Alex has completed the following number of games:

June-July: 2 Games
July-Sept: 4 Games
Sept-Oct: 2 Games

I know that the 5 calculation is working because I took a break for several months and my name completely fell off of the list.

Based on this data he shouldn't even qualify for the D12 list yet tops it in all 3 "months".
Matty wrote:
You're supposed to have 5 (completed or active) games in the last 15 days. He's in a few active games right now and those count as well.
Without this rule, it'd be really hard for a non premium member to be in the d12 list who doesn't like playing live games.

While this is good, it seems Alex is playing some test games (like this) who wouldn't count towards the d12 list when we get around to implement them properly. Without these he wouldn't qualify.

There's nothing wrong with playing some test games of course, but combine that with games like this where he often starts a turn one day, lets it hang and then completes it another, it does start to look a bit like he's gaming the system.

@Alex: Maybe you should honourbound-style decline the invitation to the d12 games if you're not really active anymore? Just to show people that you don't play these test games to game the system but only because you want to try things out so that you can get even better when you're active again?
"Strength doesn't lie in numbers, strength doesn't lie in wealth. Strength lies in nights of peaceful slumbers." ~Maria
periwinkle wrote:
Matty
@Alex: Maybe you should honourbound-style decline the invitation to the d12 games if you're not really active anymore? Just to show people that you don't play these test games to game the system but only because you want to try things out so that you can get even better when you're active again?

That assumes he cares how people view him, otherwise the behavior will continue.  The question is for you....how imiportant is it to enforce this 5 game rule? If the answer is yes, then enforce it now (and not include Alex in this months game) and now that you are aware of the loophole...continue to check for it from this point forward. What happens now and what you do speaks volumes to how you want to run this site. 



elysium5 wrote:
periwinkle
Matty
@Alex: Maybe you should honourbound-style decline the invitation to the d12 games if you're not really active anymore? Just to show people that you don't play these test games to game the system but only because you want to try things out so that you can get even better when you're active again?

That assumes he cares how people view him, otherwise the behavior will continue.  The question is for you....how imiportant is it to enforce this 5 game rule? If the answer is yes, then enforce it now (and not include Alex in this months game) and now that you are aware of the loophole...continue to check for it from this point forward. What happens now and what you do speaks volumes to how you want to run this site. 



https://dominating12.com/forums/6/suggestions-feedback/3796/recent-activity-list/post/84666#post-84666
"Bad Deadpool... Good Deadpool!"
AlexCheckMate wrote:
periwinkle
Matty
@Alex: Maybe you should honourbound-style decline the invitation to the d12 games if you're not really active anymore? Just to show people that you don't play these test games to game the system but only because you want to try things out so that you can get even better when you're active again?

That assumes he cares how people view him, otherwise the behavior will continue.  The question is for you....how imiportant is it to enforce this 5 game rule? If the answer is yes, then enforce it now (and not include Alex in this months game) and now that you are aware of the loophole...continue to check for it from this point forward. What happens now and what you do speaks volumes to how you want to run this site. 

Loophole? I'm not sure why I'm being incriminated here.

To give some background information:

Message: mafia
From: Tennesseelogman
To: AlexCheckMate

Tennesseelogman said:
05 Sep 2022, 13:03
hey - want to think about joining the mafia game that starts today?
AlexCheckMate said:
05 Sep 2022, 13:32
Hey TLM,

Thanks for reaching out!
I think for the coming year, I won't have extra time to put in mafia; I became a father for the first time this summer. Just doing a few turns/week is all I can legitimately go for :p

-Alex
Tennesseelogman said:
05 Sep 2022, 13:34
congratulations- it is one of the biggest blessings

Hence my decreased activity (not that I need to explain it?).

With the decreased activity, there was a month in which I thought I messed up to qualify for D12, by being 1 game short by my count. Apparently that wasn't the case as I was in the list anyway.
From that I concluded that the phrasing for the D12 list was open for other interpretation; not needing to complete 5, but just take turns in 5 (I think I also spoke about this somewhere on the forum? Can't quite remember). With that being the case, I reckon I'm not doing anything wrong and played like this. I'm sorry if this caused for any bad blood with anyone, I never had any wrong intentions.

I deliberately play just a few games (& fully quit mafia, at least for the time being). Time became just much more cramped than I expected and priorities needed to be changed.

I'm completely fine with the idea of changing any of the settings that are currently live for the selection process of the D12 list from whenever this gets publicly announced for everyone to clearly be aware of. Whether this would be to exempt test games, have separate lists for long/short term, some way to count things differently (e.g. more emphasis on caps or domination instead of death match). Anything goes for me (probably best to also publicly discuss about it; see what the consensus is of the players?).

-Alex
“Gravitation cannot be held responsible for people falling in love. How on earth can you explain in terms of chemistry and physics so important a biological phenomenon as first love? Put your hand on a stove for a minute and it seems like an hour. Sit with that special girl for an hour and it seems like a minute. That's relativity.”

― Albert Einstein
periwinkle wrote:
very cool! congrats on the new baby! yes, priorities do change with a little one. enjoy the time you have with them...they grow up too fast.
dough_boy wrote:
The intention is to have 5 active (I disagree with) or completed games. If your “test game” is counted in your 5 that doesn’t seem right. No one else seems to have a hard time meeting/exceeding the 5 completed in a month (let alone 2 weeks). You have managed to have exactly 2 completed games in each of the last 3 “months”.

I know you are busy, and there is no reason for you to worry about dropping off the list for any length of time. As soon as you have time you can quickly be first in the list again.

Ultimately, you admit that you are only doing the bare minimum to be on the list when to me the intention of the list is who are the best players for the last month. Playing in the D12 game, one other game to even points back up, and maybe some test games doesn’t seem like it is worth.

What is your reasoning/strategy in your games (including the test game) for taking your turn, attacking, and then waiting hours to finalize fortifying? You did this in at least 2 games that I saw, but not in the D12 game…almost like intentionally stretching out games as long as possible so they count as your “5” to be on the list.
AlexCheckMate wrote:
Yes; I'm intentionally aiming for the bare minimum.

As said, I have no problem whatsoever to see changes come. If it gets decided and publicly announced that the current bare minimum isn't the bare minimum anymore in the future and that other requirements need to be met, then that'll be it. To be absolutely explicit: I agree, upon learning about the dismay for counting test games towards D12 in a vocal part of the community, that there is a good reason to exclude test games from the counter towards D12.

I would also like to point out that I've been playing just a few games for quite a long time already... over a year...
In my first year, I've played 561 (out of a total of 823) games. It's been decreasing since and I've never heard any complaints about not playing enough games (for D12 qualification).

[image]

- Alex

PS There was a period I had here on D12, during which I strived for high rating change/over time; one of the main reasons which made me limit my # of games over time.
“Gravitation cannot be held responsible for people falling in love. How on earth can you explain in terms of chemistry and physics so important a biological phenomenon as first love? Put your hand on a stove for a minute and it seems like an hour. Sit with that special girl for an hour and it seems like a minute. That's relativity.”

― Albert Einstein
elysium5 wrote:
I don't think that the original intention was for 'test' games to count. Regardless of the specific game types people play or are 'expert' at, the one common theme is that all of those games actually matter as points are on the line for the minimum required games played/playing to be on the list.

Using test games to flush out the requirements shouldn't count as meeting the requirements.

At this time, I think the only question should be whether or not test games should count towards meeting the requirements.

I don't think they should count but I would like to hear if anyone thinks they should and why. It would be good to hear what others might have to say first.

Please remember, this question is not about picking apart any players in particular or their choices of game-types. Just a question of whether or not 'test' games meet the requirements as originally intended.
"Bad Deadpool... Good Deadpool!"
dough_boy wrote:
“Test games” should not be up for discussion as they are just that…test. 

I think we are missing the point. We should be discussing what is the purpose of the D12. The entire reason for the “5 games played” is because I brought it up before someone could be at the top of the list and never play another game (or just the D12 game each month).

I think we need to determine if we want a D12 list, if so what is the purpose of it, and then how do you get on it, etc.

In my opinion I think there are differences in opinion around the entire D12 because if we were all on the same page we wouldn’t be having this discussion.
bluebonnet wrote:

no, test games should not count. nor should games that are draws. or games that have "official suicides" with points awarded back, nor games you join but leave before they kick off. if no winner or loser in normal coursr of events, it is not a valid game.

as for what constitutes number of games played to achieve d12. like i always say, look at the data. the answer will present itself.
i love playing with large data sets if you want someone to play with it for some graphical representation of what average players do and where the outliers are.




bluebonnet is online.