North Atlantic - Viking Age

This is my first attempt at map-making - it is not intended as a proposed map for D12. I did it as a learning exercise, so would really appreciate any feedback/advice on just about anything to do with it, but more specifically; (i) My process, (ii) Potential game-play issues, (iii) the map iteself. [b]1 - Choosing the map[/b] The first job was finding a simple reference map to work from. In this case, I chose the expansion of the Vikings across the North Atlantic. [spoiler=Example 1: Reference map][img]http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex1.jpg[/img][/spoiler] [b]2 - Cleaning up the map[/b] I removed all extraneous information, routes, legend, gridlines, etc. to give myself a clean image to work over. [spoiler=Example 2: Cleaned map][img]http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex2.jpg[/img][/spoiler] I wasn't worried about quality or consistency of colour at this point, and I tried to keep things like lakes and rivers to use as possible territory borders or impassable areas. [b]3 - Territories and space[/b] At this point, I added territory circles and names, just to see how many the map could support and to make sure there was enough space. [spoiler=Example 3: Map with 25 territories][img]http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex3.jpg[/img][/spoiler] Then I paused and left the map alone for a few days - the idea being to come back with fresh eyes later. I'd read all the forum guidance on map-making and there was lots of sage advice about gameplay. So, I decided to focus on this next. [b]4 - Gameplay[/b] I ran the map through the [i]Domination[/i] Map Editor and played a couple of games. This immediately threw up two problems (not map related - more to do with my own memory!) I couldn't easily identify regions, and I couldn't remember how all the territories connected. [i]Looks like I dived into playing it too soon![/i] I went back to my map and added some temporary region colours plus connecting lines for all the territories. This workaround allowed me to spend a lot more time playing the map properly - which generated three more problems. [u]This time[/u] they were very definitely game-play issues: [list][li]Iceland was proving to be a bottle-neck as I had set it up as the main East-West route.[/li] [li]Territories were swapping between players at lightning speed and regions were proving to be undefendable - basically, I had too many connections.[/li] [li]There just weren't enough territories..[/li][/list] [u]Solutions[/u] The first thing I did, was to study [b][i]ALL[/i][/b] the existing D12 maps. This gave me a much better understanding of game flow, links, borders, bottle-necks and entry points into regions. So, I went back to the map and made some alterations: [list][li]I split the regions down further, adding 10 new territories and 1 new region.[/li] [li]I removed nearly all the links through Iceland and spread a smaller number of them around the map.[/li] [li]I reduced the overall number of links between territories.[/li][/list] [spoiler=Example 4: Expanded map][img]http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex4.jpg[/img][/spoiler] This version of the map was a lot more fun to play, but really needed input from other people. Once again, I paused and left the map for a few days. [b]5 - Developing the graphics[/b] When I went back to the map, I decided to work on the graphics - mainly to get to grips with Paint.Net, but also with a view to this posting, and the chance to ask others for feedback/tuition. Here is the map in its current state: [spoiler=Example 5: Latest Version][img]http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex5.jpg[/img][/spoiler] The colours have been chosen to be as colour-blind friendly as possible (tested on the [url=https://www.color-blindness.com/coblis-color-blindness-simulator/]Coblis Color Blindness Simulator[/url]) Even as I thought about writing this post, I was reviewing the map and noting changes that would make it better: [list][li]The small island underneath territory 8 needs to be deleted/moved to make the connecting line between territories 8 and 10 more obvious.[/li] [li]The city circles and names for territories 32 and 34 need to be moved further inland.[/li] [li]Territory 29 needs to be extended underneath territory 28, all the way to the sea, reducing the number of border territories in the sand coloured region from 5 to 4, making it easier to defend.[/li][/list] As I mentioned at the start of this post, this is an opportunity for me to learn some new skills and improve some old ones, so I welcome any criticism, feedback or guidance.

Hey there Bearskin, Let me start of by giving you praise. What an amazing job you did at producing this map as well as communicating about it - it was a pleasure to read your process in this post. I'm not involved in any mapmaking, so I'm not going to dive into any feedback at this point just yet - let me just say that I agree with your last 3 notes for changes you still plan to incorporate. Once the map goes beta (if you/others too see such potential), I'll gladly try and give some more useful feedback for the map itself. I've noticed you around at some other places and you seem to be a prime addition to D12 :D Good things (new awesome people), can stem from bad things (Corona crisis)^^ -Alex

I think it's just because it's a small map looks a little bit empty but I'm sure that will fix itself when doing more messing around with the background, mini map and name. Keep up the good work (:

I am very impressed. I haven't had time to read every word, but I can see instantly when someone has graphics skills. I think if this map shows any interest as a game map, then we could help you develop it into a D12 map, whilst honing your skills and knowledge on D12 Risk Maps and Game Map Creation procedures. Alternatively, if there are any other maps that you have in mind or any that have been suggested, but are looking for a creator, then we could help you with that. I will have a better read of this post tomorrow, when I am not so tired. Regards aero

I like the idea of a viking theme. i like your colour theme/tones. i think this has potential! i too, use the domination map editor, it's a great way to test the gameplay. cleaning up the map must of taken quite a while to do, it might of been easier to just draw the outline, but cleaning it up would have been some good practice with your paint program as it will come in handy, and the more familiar and faster you get the lesser time on the tedious stuff, and more time on the creative stuff. i've only had just a quick read through. i'll get a chance over the weekend, well done.

As a new potential map maker, and this is coming from someone who has no idea about what it takes to make maps, I wanted to point out that the process will involve a lot of constructive criticism and scrutiny but it is all for the goal of creating a truly worthy D12 map and we take a lot of pride in our maps. Not everyone can collaborate and work together with each other when it comes down to developing a map so please understand that any suggestions or feedback is intended to perfect an idea, not criticize it. You clearly have some skills and I want to make sure you don't get discouraged with the time it takes to bring a map to its completion. If an idea and map is good, we spend a lot of time going over the minutia to make it the best it can be. Kudos's to the map makers as I could never hope to be able to do what you do!

@@elysium5 Worry not - criticism and scrutiny is exactly what I was looking for :thumbs: The care and effort that goes into the maps is one of the reasons I like this site so much.

Many thanks for all the comments and help I have received to date. [spoiler=Updated Map][img]http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex6.jpg[/img][/spoiler] [url=http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex6.jpg]100% view[/url]

North Atlantic is hard to read Are there trees, mountains, or rivers on any of these? Not that they have to be impassible, but maybe they add something? On my computer, it is hard to read the names of the territories. Does it conform to the dimensions needed for D12? It seems small dimension wise. Did the Vikings ever go from Telemark to Saksland?

@@dough_boy All good points - working on game-play at the moment - leaving graphics alone for now. I still see this map as a learning curve, so no point working on the graphics unless there is interest in developing it into an actual D12 map. If that were to happen though; [u]Title and territory names[/u] Definitely need further work. [u]Trees, mountains, etc[/u] I haven't put textures or features on any of the territories yet. [u]Map dimensions[/u] I took my queue from the [b]DXII Guide to Map Making[/b] - [i]Image Format and Size[/i] notes. [list][li]1024px wide and minimum 600px high[/li][/list] [u]Telemark <> Saksland[/u] Yes they did. In the very first test I ran using the [b][i]Domination [/i][/b]map editor, I had links between Saksland and all the scandinavian countries, but it made both regions (Teutonia and Saxony) impossible to defend, so I reduced the number of links. They could well end up being reinstated at some point - given further testing.

Hi Bearskin :) I don't have time right now but I would love to give you some of my thoughts very soon - impressive work so far!

Ok here we go :) I really like the work you've done so far - it's a really cool map! Since you are working primarily on the gameplay at the moment, I will focus my comments primarily on that. Firstly, while I think gameplay is crucially important, I don't think it should be manipulated to seem unnatural or contrary to the theme. What I mean by this, is that connections should be intuitive; don't connect really far territories and leave almost neighbouring territories disconnected, wherever possible (this is my personal opinion). Moreover, in this case, there is a danger that forced connections could compromise the really cool theme (viking expansion, circa 800-1000AD) by creating fictitious sea routes that were never used or by omitting major sea routes that are well-documented. In other words, there is a danger that the theme becomes inaccurate and almost fictional just because you want the gameplay to be balanced. I guess the reason I'm harping on about this so much is because the theme is so unique, I absolutely love it! Since it is historical, I would consider using only real viking sea routes unless it becomes absolutely impossible to make viable gameplay otherwise. For a bit of thematic flair, you could even add dates to the connection lines (similar to those on your reference map). I'm sure it would be possible to make gameplay work. [spoiler=Latest version of the map (for reference):][img]http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex5.jpg[/img][/spoiler] I think that while the gameplay you have currently suggested is functional, in my opinion it sacrifices a bit of the theme. In particular, the connection from Vinland (terr.10) to Eire (terr.30) is not a real viking sea route, neither is Scorsfjord (terr.14) to Lapp (terr.19)(so far as I can tell) , and the lack of connection between Telemark (terr.25) and Saksland (terr.31) runs contrary to the theme. If 10-30 and 14-19 were removed and 25-31 was added, it would lead to a bottleneck in Iceland again :S Looking at a few historical maps we can look to find a solution that fits the theme perfectly and also results in good gameplay (and if we can't find a perfect match between theme and gameplay, we can compromise): [spoiler=Source 1]https://premodernexplorationatstfx.wordpress.com/2015/11/20/viking-expansion-in-the-north-atlantic/ [img]https://premodernexplorationatstfx.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/screen-shot-2015-11-12-at-2-21-36-pm.png[/img][/spoiler] [spoiler=Source 2]https://www.researchgate.net/publication/321836321_Predictive_Models_and_Historical_Sources_for_Finding_a_North_Atlantic_Port_The_Leiruvogur_Harbour_at_the_Mouth_of_Iceland%27s_Mosfell_Valley_Jesse_Byock_and_Davide_Zori_2017/figures?lo=1 [img]https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Davide_Zori/publication/321836321/figure/fig2/AS:571917092753409@1513367068903/North-Atlantic-Sailing-Routes-Scandinavians-of-the-Viking-Age-stand-out-in-European_W640.jpg[/img][/spoiler] [spoiler=Source 3]https://www.researchgate.net/publication/49799267_On_the_trail_of_Vikings_with_polarized_skylight_Experimental_study_of_the_atmospheric_optical_prerequisites_allowing_polarimetric_navigation_by_Viking_seafarers/figures?lo=1 [img]https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Andras_Barta/publication/49799267/figure/fig3/AS:667822963306498@1536232810479/The-seven-1-7-main-Viking-sailing-routes-Route-3-connected-Hernam-nowadays-the_W640.jpg[/img][/spoiler] From these sources, we can indeed see that Iceland was almost exclusively used as the gateway from Europe to North America ("bad" for gameplay). Let's try and work around this though. Sources 2 and 3 both document a sea route from Norway to Greenland. An island north of Iceland (Jan Mayen) could be introduced along with an island north of Norway (Svalbard) to create a connection path to northern Norway (this is somewhat documented by the sources). All three sources show 2 major ports in Iceland, one on the eastern coast, one on the western. Splitting Iceland into these 2 ports, along with the Greenland-Norway route and the Svalbard-Norway route would create 4 different routes through the bottleneck (:)). I'm not saying that you have to (or even should) implement these changes - I'm just providing an example on how the connections can be completely consistent with the historicity of the theme. Taking this map to its completion would require a fair bit of research: territory names, territory borders, region names and frontiers, sea routes... I guess I can save comments on graphics for later - you seem very capable anyway, far more so than myself! A few miscellaneous points: - the land bridge between Nunavut (terr.1) and Helluland (terr.4) doesn't exist (see reference map) - I like the grey glow around the coastline :) - the viking rune things are cool, as is the dragon design in the sea. I think a design of a viking longboat would be awesome!! I've said a lot - these views are, at the end of the day, just my opinion :) I believe they are fantastic suggestions (:roll:) that would help the map to fulfil its very high potential, but I don't want to give the impression of demanding things be done in a certain way :) I love what you've done so far!

Just so I do not forget: https://dominating12.com/game/1008328 [i] 04 May, 12:29 Hoodlum: gameplay tests. thanks betamap testers. thread for map is here points returned 04 May, 13:13 AlexCheckMate: Pink is far away, capwise 04 May, 13:15 AlexCheckMate: Pink cap from Yonne to Normande & red from Inari to Ingria would help I think[/i] My current ideas on the current setup for borders/connections/locations of caps in a 5p setup Happy to see all the feedback that's flowing into this topic as well as the progress on the map =)

Made some changes as a result of feedback during initial testing and some of the comments above. [b][u]Structural Changes[/u][/b] [list][li]Removed the land-bridge between Nunavut and Helluland - @@Virtuosity98[/li] [i]originally put that land there to cut down on the number of sea links on the map. But I guess you can't avoid sea links when dealing with Vikings[/i] [li]Added sea links Nunavut <> Helluland, because of change above, and Nunavut <> Pang - @@Hoodlum[/li] [i]to open up game-play options in Capitals games[/i] [li]Extended Greenland to the north-east, forming a new connection with Tunu - @@Hoodlum[/li] [i]to open up game-play options in Capitals games[/i] [li]Widened inlet between Lapp and Rus, and added a sea link - @@Hoodlum[/li] [i]to open up game-play options[/i] [li]Added sea link between Telemark and Saksland - @@dough_boy and @@Virtuosity98 and Me as well[/li] [i]this was in the very first version i tested using the Domination Map Editor but it made the whole Scandinavian region difficult to defend - because of other connections to the east. I'd always wanted it in there because of the obvious history. The big problem in adding it back was adding another border territory to the region (5 to defend instead of 4). Played with various options on this but came up with a solution which allowed the link to be reinstated (see below)[/i] [li]Adjusted northern territory line for Perna, creating a direct land link to Halgoland[/li] [i]without impacting existing links between Lapp and Halgoland which allowed the removal of the old sea link between Perna and Roden, making Roden a non-border territory, which in turn allowed the additional sea links to Telemark (which has now become a border territory).[/i] [li]Added sea link between Telemark and Iceland.[/li] [i]Why not? It was there historically - I always wanted a way to include it.[/i] [li]Changed some of the internal border structure in Saxony[/li] [i]Simply because I didn't like the way they were (I thought the lines looked ugly). Plus, I have plans for that area graphics-wise which these changes will help in the future.[/i][/list] [b][u]Cosmetic Changes[/u][/b] [list][li]Removed edging on territory names to improve readability - @@dough_boy[/li] [i]hope they're more readable now.[/i] [li]Increased the opacity on the map title "North Atlantic"[/li] [i]was set low while I was working on the sea serpent/dragon - forgot to put it back up! [/i]:$ [li]Tidied up some of the territory borders, islands, and lakes where they clashed with key information[/li][/list] [spoiler=Updated Map][img]http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex7.jpg[/img][/spoiler] [url=http://www.pixnstuff.tr-tech.co.uk/maplearn/ex7.jpg]100% View[/url] [b][u]The link between Vinland and Eire[/u][/b] I can't see a way to avoid this. From a game-play perspective it is vital. Mainly for flow during Capitals or Domination games, but also because without it, those two territories just become dead-ends. The curvature of the sea link is supposed to imply that the voyage was possible if they followed existing routes ([b]i.e[/b] close to but [u]not necessarily[/u] stopping at Scotland, Iceland, Greenland and Markland). Perhaps they had trainee Vikings bring supplies out on small boats at each of the four [i]not-stopping[/i] points. Tenuous I know, but... Thanks for all the feedback so far - keep it coming. As before, no graphics work being done - testing gameplay at the moment.

[quote=Bearskin]Made some changes as a result of feedback during initial testing and some of the comments above.[/quote] A lot of changes! Didn't see anything with respect to my suggestions though - maybe you have reason not to (what/why?), or just simply overlooked? Dedication =) [quote=AlexCheckMate]Just so I do not forget: https://dominating12.com/game/1008328 [i] 04 May, 12:29 Hoodlum: gameplay tests. thanks betamap testers. thread for map is here points returned 04 May, 13:13 AlexCheckMate: Pink is far away, capwise 04 May, 13:15 AlexCheckMate: Pink cap from Yonne to Normande & red from Inari to Ingria would help I think[/i] My current ideas on the current setup for borders/connections/locations of caps in a 5p setup Happy to see all the feedback that's flowing into this topic as well as the progress on the map =)[/quote] There's currently 5 territories between pink/red cap => change would make it 3. There's currently 5 territories between pink/purple cap => change would make it 3. There's currently 4 territories between pink/blue cap => change wouldn't have an impact. Green is totally far away - that's cool. There's currently 2 territories between red/purple cap => change would make it 3. blue/green remain far away - that's fine. Most distances will be 3, less outliers of 2 & 5 I'm inclined to think that adding the seabridge Pang <-> Nunavut is a mistake. Green/Purple cap was 3 apart, now it's only 2 (and it removes Igluvik from gameplay, kinda).